Nigeria is better united than divided – Chukwu

Celestine Chukwu is the Chairman Celchi Global Peace Foundation and the Secretary General Igbo Community Assembly in the Federal Capital Territory (FCT). In this interview with ROSEMARY MORIBIRIN, he discussed the state of the nation, restructuring and the way forward.

Would you rather see Nigeria divided since we have been having issues?

Well, it will be better Nigeria remains united. But in remaining an entity, our differences must be respected. In remaining one, it’s better the leadership ensures that every part is carried along effectively and efficiently.


Practically, how do we ensure that leadership does what is right because it seems leadership at all tiers has decided to just carry on with the way they believe and not what the people want?


You see, one major problem Nigeria has is its constitution. The constitution gives so much powers to the centre. That is the President of the nation and there are some other articles that give favour to one part than the other. And that is why you hear the clamours for separation, secession and what have you. That is what informed the crisis on ground and that is why in some quarter, some school of thoughts would say “the best is for ethnic nationalities to go their separate ways”. You must understand one fundamental thing, Nigeria is not a nation, Nigeria is a nation-state. Those variables that determine a nation is not properly intertwined to be called a nation.

What are the variables? 


Those variables are the level of unity that is needed. The humanitarian values, the welfarism, are not there. Nigeria is divided among ethnic lines. Leadership play major role in dividing Nigeria among ethnic groups that want to take it all. Look at what is happening in leadership appointment in this country, there are some  ethnic groups that are sidelined completely and they didn’t just stop at that, they’re even going further to ensure that those ethnic groups that were sidelined are even enslaved. That is the problem, so that is why, of course,  as I said, it is better Nigerian ethnic nationalities go their separate ways.

People are not longer happy. We have first class citizens in Nigeria, second class, third class and fourth class. This trackers was created by leadership from certain areas and is causing  a lot of harm to Nigeria’s peace and if there is no peace, there will be no unity and if there is no unity, there is no oneness. And that oneness is what determine a nation. But here, it’s not viable, why? Because of the kind of leadership that we have. The truth remains that we lack leadership.


Currently, the National Assembly is  carrying out constitutional review. Do you trust that that they will produce the document Nigerians desire?


No! I said No! The National Assembly is there when the government was making appointments and those people they appointed were coming to National Assembly for them to screen them. Didn’t they see the lopsided appointment by the President? What did they do about it? The crisis we have in our hands today is that the National Assembly is not there. They are part of the problem. So the Constitution review being carried out in National Assembly cannot solve the problem because the ingredients that should be included in those review will not be there. We need people who really want to stand for their people. We need leaders. That you are in the position of leadership does not make u a leader. So we need leaders, we need different ethnic leaders to come together. What happened to the National Conference of 2014? What are they reviewing?  After review, who would consent to it? Is it not the President? No! Something is fundamentally wrong with the National Assembly.


Recently, the Southern Governors recommended ban on open grazing. They charged the President to find  solutions to insecurity. Do you think they went in the right direction?


Well, I think I will say they just woke up from slumber. They have slept for a very long time and that was what brought the the section of the country or the entire country to where we are today in respect of insecurity. Well, their decision is in the right direction because one, if some persons are taking advantage of open grazing to commit criminal acts against the people in the environments where they take their cows to graze openly, I think it should be banned. That will help a long way in determining those responsible for all these criminal acts. It’s very good. And again, you see, open grazing has caused a lot of harm than good in the polity because that is the course of the herder/farmers crisis in the county. So their decision is in the right direction, ok? And the Federal government should look deep into it to ensure that peace reigns, otherwise, it’s not going to be funny at all. 

Some school of thoughts have said governors should have what it takes to curtail the security situation because  lots of security votes  go to them. But they seem not to be doing anything but putting all the blame on the federal government. What’s your take on this  perspective?


You see, this brings us back to the issues of constitutional provision. A governor of a state is the chief security officer of the state but he does not control the police, he does not have control over the Commissioner of Police in the state. He goes to beg the commissioner to carry out his security functions. The commissioner takes directives from the Inspector General of Police which is very counter productive. Yes he collects security votes but he has little to do with it. Except he forms his own security outfit and that is why we are talking about community policing or state police. Supposing the governors are controlling the Commissioners of Police, you can be talking about community policing but not state police. Do you understand? Now you see, this is what now give rise to formation of security outfits that are outside government control or control from the centre. They all collect security votes although some of them collect security votes, we don’t know what they do with those votes. But I think they are handicapped in an aspect of control. The police that is supposed to be in charge of, at least, first hand curtail of crisis in any environment.


The governor of Benue state recently set the pace recently when he declared, and of course, backed by the State House of Assembly, that there won’t be any open grazing in the state anymore and anyone caught will face the law. He didn’t have the police under him to stand up to this, neither did he have the military to stand up to this. He went all the way to use whatever resources under him to get this done, why can’t other governors emulate him? 


It is a very good example. He has laid very good precedence. It beholds on the governors of the states to ensure the life and properties in their domain are secured. What he has done, he has taken the bull by the horn to ensure that his people are protected, because the police, the IGP is not doing what he should do to give the Commissioner of Police freehand to listen to the governor and I’m sure that is why the governor took that action. Every governor has the right to form security outfit to protect his people. So they should emulate the governor of Benue state. 
The leadership at the centre, as far as the current situation is concerned, is not doing very well to protect lives and property in every state of the country and that is the problem. So the people want to take their fate in their own hands and that is what is also informing the level of militarisation of the system because every man wants to protect himself. Recently, we heard of security meeting but in this security meeting, the people involved, the part of the country involved are they represent in that security meeting? What are the outcome of the meeting? what are the content of the outline measures? Take for instance, the south east, I’m not sure anybody from the south east is represented in that security meeting and you are supposed to find solution to insecurity in that part of the country. 
Let me tell you one thing, I have observed personally that there are certain leaders in this country that are still fighting in Nigeria-Biafra war till date, it as not ended in their minds, all they are looking for is to get opportunity to cling to power and use it to continue to further  that war against the south east and that is what we are seeing playing out now, we don’t know, we have to know the content, what are the measures and that will go a long way to determine the curtailing of the insecurities there or the escalation of it. One thing leaders have to understand especially at the centre is that you should know that you are from a particular ethnic nationality, and whatever you do to another is well observed. For example if an Igbo man is at the centre and there is a problem in the northwest, the way he handles the problem in the northwest will make the populace to see him as a leader of all or leader of the southeast.


At the moment judiciary is on strike. Do u believe in judiciary independence? 


Yeah, I believe in judiciary independence in totality because our institutions are weak. That is what informs leadership recklessness. This brings us back to the constitutional provision, so their  independence will strengthen them to be independent of the governor of a state to a very large extent.

So why do you think the governors to an extent are quite indifferent about granting Independence to judiciary?


Governors are indifferent because they use the judiciary to carry out unconstitutional things. Because the people in power want to determine the outcome of every case as it concerns them and their cohorts, of which judiciary frowns at this.  Because the judgement that should favour ‘A’ will be given in favour of ‘B’. If you don’t do their bidding, tomorrow you are no longer there. Look at the issue of what happened before the 2015 elections where a judge was removed and another judge from another part of the country replaced him to do the bidding of the government. That is why they are fighting for their emancipation and salvation. They want to have freedom so they can operate optimally, they want to work in the best interest of the country.

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